Common Car Myths

[jdnet]

Ok lets start a thread about myths created by Sri Lankan car sellers and buyers. BTW please make this baed on facts and not your opinions. We all have opinions, that doesn't mean they are facts.

I'll start.

4 cylinder engines are always more efficient that 6 cylinder ones.

False. The number of cylinders is much less important than the engines ability to move the car. If you have an under powered 4 cylinder pushing a heavy car you would burn more fuel than a smaller 6 cylinder pushing it. Basically fuels figures have more to do with the horsepower to wieght ratio than the number of cylinders. So to save fuel you would need the smallest engine that would push the car with ease while not over-working itself.

Edited December 19, 2010 by jdnet

[gpmac]

used JDM cars are of a higher quality when compared to the same vehicle brought brand new

many car sales guys are of this opinion, they make this point over and over when selling models that are available brand new here, there might have been a case for this maybe in the early 90s but in the current context its rather a ploy to make sure ppl continue to buy used vehicles

[Elvis_Pil]

I'm really not too sure about that- Japan Car makers have historically reserved the best for their own market- anyway.. you got any case examples to prove you're point?

used JDM cars are of a higher quality when compared to the same vehicle brought brand new

many car sales guys are of this opinion, they make this point over and over when selling models that are available brand new here, there might have been a case for this maybe in the early 90s but in the current context its rather a ploy to make sure ppl continue to buy used vehicles

[AL998]

used JDM cars are of a higher quality when compared to the same vehicle brought brand new

many car sales guys are of this opinion, they make this point over and over when selling models that are available brand new here, there might have been a case for this maybe in the early 90s but in the current context its rather a ploy to make sure ppl continue to buy used vehicles

I'm not sure about this either.It is a fact that japs made best for JDM .Engines,Gearboxes are the same but quality of interior is clearly a notch ahead of the rest.I Don't know whether they have changed in the recent past..

[DevakaC]

I'm really not too sure about that- Japan Car makers have historically reserved the best for their own market- anyway.. you got any case examples to prove you're point?

Mate Elvis I beg to differ. Do you imply the japs made a lesser or inferior car for the rest of the world while they made a better car for their own Japanese Domestic market?

Unless the car was assembled/made in another country, a car that comes brand new from Japan itself is as good as a JDM or even better IMO. Due to the high amounts of import taxes that prevailed over the years and due to every option in a car individually being taxed, most people who bought these brand new tended to cut on the options. So they appeared to many as a lesser car. Just as how people compare a 1992 built LN-107 to a LN-106. Now if the Japs made two different engines, gearboxes and body shells for the export and domestic market I could agree with you.

Im sure the question about GDI engines would come up now. But thats a totally different story.

[Buddhika M H]

Mate Elvis I beg to differ. Do you imply the japs made a lesser or inferior car for the rest of the world while they made a better car for their own Japanese Domestic market?

Unless the car was assembled/made in another country, a car that comes brand new from Japan itself is as good as a JDM or even better IMO. Due to the high amounts of import taxes that prevailed over the years and due to every option in a car individually being taxed, most people who bought these brand new tended to cut on the options. So they appeared to many as a lesser car. Just as how people compare a 1992 built LN-107 to a LN-106. Now if the Japs made two different engines, gearboxes and body shells for the export and domestic market I could agree with you.

Im sure the question about GDI engines would come up now. But thats a totally different story.

Maybe you got a point, its possible that many so called inferior quality may come from plants which are in other countries catering to markets other than JDM.

Also I think JDM vehicles has less 'lifetime' (or use-time) within the JD Market, as they are usually shipped elsewhere within couple of years. So cant think any reason why they would make it 'more' durable than any other market?

[Buddhika M H]

Ok lets start a thread about myths created by Sri Lankan car sellers and buyers. BTW please make this baed on facts and not your opinions. We all have opinions, that doesn't mean they are facts.

I'll start.

4 cylinder engines are always more efficient that 6 cylinder ones.

False. The number of cylinders is much less important than the engines ability to move the car. If you have an under powered 4 cylinder pushing a heavy car you would burn more fuel than a smaller 6 cylinder pushing it. Basically fuels figures have more to do with the horsepower to wieght ratio than the number of cylinders. So to save fuel you would need the smallest engine that would push the car with ease while not over-working itself.

I would add the engine capacity. As its clear that most people think 1800cc engine is much thirstier than a 1500cc for a normal sedan. Same with 1300cc and 1500cc.

Also I think many people concerned more about the engine capacity than the no. of cylinders, maybe because they'rent sure about how number of cylinders work ?

[heavyD]

I would add the engine capacity. As its clear that most people think 1800cc engine is much thirstier than a 1500cc for a normal sedan. Same with 1300cc and 1500cc.

Also I think many people concerned more about the engine capacity than the no. of cylinders, maybe because they'rent sure about how number of cylinders work ?

That, or because most cars here are four cylinder ones.

[Pericles]

Also I think many people concerned more about the engine capacity than the no. of cylinders, maybe because they'rent sure about how number of cylinders work ?

My dad did that to me when I wanted to buy a 1.8 V6 MX3, saying it'll use a lotta fuel. I'm pretty sure my current 1.6 4 pot uses more than that car would!

[Ripper]

As its clear that most people think 1800cc engine is much thirstier than a 1500cc for a normal sedan. Same with 1300cc and 1500cc.

In most cases...the 1800cc is actually more thirstier than the 1500 if you compare cars of the same era and possibly of similar stature. A newer 1800 with better engineering might out do an older 1500 but if you compare similar cars i doubt the 1800 will be equal or better than the 1500. If it's not the case i'd love to see an example

I feel the problem is that some people simply compare fuel figure using only the displacement as a yard stick which i think is completely wrong. The age of the vehicle, weight of it etc too come into the equation

which is kinda why 1300cc cars are seen as less fuel efficient than a 1500.

[Buddhika M H]

In most cases...the 1800cc is actually more thirstier than the 1500 if you compare cars of the same era and possibly of similar stature. A newer 1800 with better engineering might out do an older 1500 but if you compare similar cars i doubt the 1800 will be equal or better than the 1500. If it's not the case i'd love to see an example

I feel the problem is that some people simply compare fuel figure using only the displacement as a yard stick which i think is completely wrong. The age of the vehicle, weight of it etc too come into the equation

which is kinda why 1300cc cars are seen as less fuel efficient than a 1500.

I totally agree on that, thats why I said ".. 1800cc engine is much thirstier than a 1500cc..", usually it is a bit more consuming, but not as much as people believe it to be.

I feel ( do not have exact numbers) that a 1800cc bit heavy sedan (even a Allion might do?) might be better in the hill country than a 1500cc equivalent?

[BLu3HaZe]

Guys I've heard some people saying a Nissan/Mitsubishi engine would last around 300k km in good condition and Toyota block usually lasts around 100k km more, any base to that argument? I've not seen any Jap car with such mileage in SL anyway, maybe due to turning back odo's.

[Iroshana]

Guys I've heard some people saying a Nissan/Mitsubishi engine would last around 300k km in good condition and Toyota block usually lasts around 100k km more, any base to that argument? I've not seen any Jap car with such mileage in SL anyway, maybe due to turning back odo's.

We have one Toyota LN106 (3L) which has done 330,000Km. Overhauled around 200,000kms. So far doing well.

Other one is Mitsubishi Pajero (4d56) also done more than 300,000km with one overhaul. So far doing well.

[BLu3HaZe]

Yup both those are diesel heavy duty engines, them being run like hell is more common I guess as I've seen even pics of odo's posted here with extreme mileage, so similar conditions is quite acceptable. But does it hold true for smaller petrol engines in cars? Do other manufacturers such as Nissan sacrifice durability slightly for power? Speaking of Nissan more as I've noticed their engines get much more hotter compared to other JDM imports

[Killer-B]

Yup both those are diesel heavy duty engines, them being run like hell is more common I guess as I've seen even pics of odo's posted here with extreme mileage, so similar conditions is quite acceptable. But does it hold true for smaller petrol engines in cars? Do other manufacturers such as Nissan sacrifice durability slightly for power? Speaking of Nissan more as I've noticed their engines get much more hotter compared to other JDM imports

Well, could be that they are designed to work on a slightly higher temperature than the others, but I've noticed this with Toyota's VVTi engine on the Vitz.

[BLu3HaZe]

Well, could be that they are designed to work on a slightly higher temperature than the others, but I've noticed this with Toyota's VVTi engine on the Vitz.

Maybe so, and I've noticed this especially in the Sunny. Primera P11s with the SR18DE had a lot of damping stuff under the hood but wasn't that extreme.

The 1.0L engine or the 1.3L? We've a 2NZ-FE and it runs quite cool even in long distances 3 Cyl maybe different though, not sure

[The Don]

I'm really not too sure about that- Japan Car makers have historically reserved the best for their own market- anyway.. you got any case examples to prove you're point?

Elvis, I don't think I can quite agree with your statement that japanese car makers historically reserved the best for their own market.

The trim levels differ market to market (plus you have the option of adding them on, if you're buying brand new)

JDM models have the bells and whistles the Japanese market require and so you get things like air conditioning as standard.

But things like airbags became standard a lot earlier in Japanese cars sold in Europe than Japan (since early 1990s all Japanese cars sold in the UK have at least one airbag)

So they simply customise their models to different market, and it's neither better nor worse, just what they think is suitable. Even in Sri Lanka the "brand new version" available was better for certain models than the JDM and a good example is the Isuzu Fargo van (which has a reputation for rusting quite quickly) and the Isuzu WFR which was sold brand new (My Dad had one given to him by the company, not a patch of rust in nearly a decade of use)

[The Don]

I think when it comes to Diesel engines, and longevity Isuzu is the one to beat If you want examples, look at the number of lorries from the 1970s 1980s still in operation (slowly being replaced by Indian versions).

To be honest I don't think there is much difference in longevity mechanically between Japanese brands. For one, most of the internal components are made by exactly the same part manufacturers and quality control has been quite good.

Its very difficult to judge mileage in SL because in recons the odometer is very rarely correct (maybe things are a little better now with JAAI certificates but unless you have a service book to back it up, you still can't be 100% sure). But I recon a heavy duty diesel should do 300K KMS without an issue. I know enough petrols over here which have done more than 200K miles and still running !

Guys I've heard some people saying a Nissan/Mitsubishi engine would last around 300k km in good condition and Toyota block usually lasts around 100k km more, any base to that argument? I've not seen any Jap car with such mileage in SL anyway, maybe due to turning back odo's.

[BLu3HaZe]

I think when it comes to Diesel engines, and longevity Isuzu is the one to beat If you want examples, look at the number of lorries from the 1970s 1980s still in operation (slowly being replaced by Indian versions).

To be honest I don't think there is much difference in longevity mechanically between Japanese brands. For one, most of the internal components are made by exactly the same part manufacturers and quality control has been quite good.

Its very difficult to judge mileage in SL because in recons the odometer is very rarely correct (maybe things are a little better now with JAAI certificates but unless you have a service book to back it up, you still can't be 100% sure). But I recon a heavy duty diesel should do 300K KMS without an issue. I know enough petrols over here which have done more than 200K miles and still running !

Yes Isuzu lorries I've seen mostly in government stuff and been heavily abused yet going on still. Diesels supposedly live longer because of low revolutions etc?

As for petrol cars, I brought up the question as some have told me, when I ask why they prefer Toyota's other than resale value and common perception etc., they say that most other petrol blocks are in a bad shape when around 300k km while Toyota blocks can take another 100k km or so. Was wondering whether it was just another myth or real.

[Killer-B]

Maybe so, and I've noticed this especially in the Sunny. Primera P11s with the SR18DE had a lot of damping stuff under the hood but wasn't that extreme.

The 1.0L engine or the 1.3L? We've a 2NZ-FE and it runs quite cool even in long distances 3 Cyl maybe different though, not sure

This was with the older vitz(SCP10) mate, a 1L 1SZ-FE IIRC but this is supposed to be a 4 cylinder block right?

[charitha19]

my old astina was around the 300K mark when i sold it.. no problems with the engine..

[Ripper]

I think when it comes to Diesel engines, and longevity Isuzu is the one to beat If you want examples, look at the number of lorries from the 1970s 1980s still in operation (slowly being replaced by Indian versions).

To be honest I don't think there is much difference in longevity mechanically between Japanese brands. For one, most of the internal components are made by exactly the same part manufacturers and quality control has been quite good.

Its very difficult to judge mileage in SL because in recons the odometer is very rarely correct (maybe things are a little better now with JAAI certificates but unless you have a service book to back it up, you still can't be 100% sure). But I recon a heavy duty diesel should do 300K KMS without an issue. I know enough petrols over here which have done more than 200K miles and still running !

got a ford diesel with genuine mileage (brand new import and owned by the agents)...closing up on 230k on the clock...rebuilt once at 200k...

[Supra_Natural]

got a ford diesel with genuine mileage (brand new import and owned by the agents)...closing up on 230k on the clock...rebuilt once at 200k...

Haha.... not bad ripper "built Ford tough" in action I see.

However, I see your 230k and raise you this...

'93 Hilux 106. 3L Motor, one rebuild at 250k.

Of course pretty much any brand new import with traceable, proper service history should be capable of going on indefinitely if you run it enough and keep it running well.

Edited January 27, 2011 by Supra_Natural

[The Don]

Haha.... not bad ripper "built Ford tough" in action I see.

However, I see your 230k and raise you this...

'93 Hilux 106. 3L Motor, one rebuild at 250k.

Of course pretty much any brand new import with traceable, proper service history should be capable of going on indefinitely if you run it enough and keep it running well.

That's impressive Supra, considering the rebuild engine seems to have held up quite well.

I'm a little concerned at 2.5/ 3L diesel engines needing rebuilds at 200-250K levels, and on these examples the vehicles are definitely not clocked. What do you think is contributing to this untimely wear of the engine ? I mean I can understand things like valve seats etc but piston rings and bores ?

[BLu3HaZe]

This was with the older vitz(SCP10) mate, a 1L 1SZ-FE IIRC but this is supposed to be a 4 cylinder block right?

Yes the 1SZ-FE was a 4 cyl and haven't noticed it being too hot but maybe it's with some engines of some manufacturers then. Lean burn engines should mostly run hot as I see.

my old astina was around the 300K mark when i sold it.. no problems with the engine..

Thanks for the info!

Conclusion - Toyota engines living longer than others = Myth

And Supra_N, you got another double cab with 300k+ km right? A Mitsu IIRC, saw pics in AL

Edited January 27, 2011 by BLu3HaZe