I'm Sorry Carbon B4, Sylvi And The Rest Of The People I Have Hurt

[VVTi]

But machang, if only you did not try to push the boundries of physics with that average family sedan, you would have avoided all this harrang. No point getting all phiosophical now, right?

Were you trying to show off? I dunno about you, but pusing the car to to its limit let alone going past 60 inside the city is a big NO NO for me now. Too many variables to deal with.(you never knwo when the next B4 driver is going to take a corner too fast)

What do you say? Imagine if you hit the car in a different way? YOu could have been killed, ending this entertainment, for sure. Your passengers would have died. Or worse still, a bystander would have got hurt.

Getting all philosphical now is a bit late, neda machang?

[Ripper]

The impact missed the air bag sensor unit by less than an inch !!, had it gone off it would have been condemned and no way insurance would want to go ahead with the repair....

machang...afaik...air bag sensors don't need to be hit. they measure rapid deceleration and fire up! hence they are called accelerometers.

with the level of damage you describe, air bags should have gone.

[VVTi]

The decision to condemn a car is taken if the repair cost is going to be significant % of the sum insured, and not necessarily if the car is repairable or not.

The insurance Company guys will off set the possible scrap value Vs the amount they need to pay out and will take the call. So if anyone wants to get it condemned its just a matter of inflating the repair cost. And all these cars end up back on the road, as insurance cos sell them off .

You can sugar coat it anyway you like, but a bent car is an unsafe car. A car with crappy alignment is an unsafe car, so imagine an actually bent car. Thats my take on it. You should have condemned it and walked away. Vehicles have been condemned for far less damages. Since you are a part time broker you could have scored another car, right?

[VVTi]

machang...afaik...air bag sensors don't need to be hit. they measure rapid deceleration and fire up! hence they are called accelerometers.

with the level of damage you describe, air bags should have gone.

Clearly the sensors were already shot by the time this crash happened.

Would have been an intersting topic if he was hit head on... Imagine, an AL member with the words MOMO engraved to his face? Now thats Brand Loyalty!

[CARBON B4]

If the air bags are diploid is it considered as condemned?

No... its just that the cost of replacing the air bags + the rest of the repair cost could bee too much, and Insurance will consider it a write off....

[CARBON B4]

machang...afaik...air bag sensors don't need to be hit. they measure rapid deceleration and fire up! hence they are called accelerometers.

with the level of damage you describe, air bags should have gone.

I don't think its the case.... a rapid deceleration does not necessarily trigger the bags to go off, there needs to be impact, and that too a significant one.

You should have condemned it and walked away. Vehicles have been condemned for far less damages. Since you are a part time broker you could have scored another car, right?

Had I walked away I would have got the full insured value... now why would I try to sell it after having spend all that time and effort ?

Anyway Its my car my petrol,....... and there are many more cars that have crashed but are back on the roads, I know of several Sti s like that.... but the real issue here is not the accident, its the fact that I am accused of trying to sell the car to another A/L member by concealing the accident...

[Ripper]

I don't think its the case.... a rapid deceleration does not necessarily trigger the bags to go off, there needs to be impact, and that too a significant one.

Nope. they do work on rapid deceleration. Impacts are infact rapid decelerations and that's how the sensors pick up when to fire the bags.

http://www.midsouthrescue.org/id7.html

If the impact was hard enough to bend a chassis, needing a jig to re align....the airbags should have deployed.

Unless there is something wrong with the system.

Edited April 9, 2012 by Ripper

[VVTi]

I don't think its the case.... a rapid deceleration does not necessarily trigger the bags to go off, there needs to be impact, and that too a significant one.

Had I walked away I would have got the full insured value... now why would I try to sell it after having spend all that time and effort ?

Anyway Its my car my petrol,....... and there are many more cars that have crashed but are back on the roads, I know of several Sti s like that.... but the real issue here is not the accident, its the fact that I am accused of trying to sell the car to another A/L member by concealing the accident...

Aney Manda.... umbatanang hondatoma pissu. In fact Pissu Double!

I think I have now realised that you are a real Goat. Hence I will now refrain from getting in to any discussions about this B4 of yours.

Your friends were right, you are a real bite...

[jdnet]

Aney Manda.... umbatanang hondatoma pissu. In fact Pissu Double!

I think I have now realised that you are a real Goat. Hence I will now refrain from getting in to any discussions about this B4 of yours.

Your friends were right, you are a real bite...

megabite.

[jdnet]

Nope. they do work on rapid deceleration. Impacts are infact rapid decelerations and that's how the sensors pick up when to fire the bags.

http://www.midsouthrescue.org/id7.html

If the impact was hard enough to bend a chassis, needing a jig to re align....the airbags should have deployed.

Unless there is something wrong with the system.

He probably removed them to prevent the dashboard getting damaged if they were to deploy in a crash. Maybe he tried to make the car lighter to improve performance by removing them. Who knows what this guy did to prevent the air bags from deploying in an accident that took out the front end.

[Komisiripala]

current catfight notwithstanding, that is one nasty accident. was it raining? i'd expect the AWD of the legacy to keep you on course at times like this.

sorry to hear about the car tho. it pulls the heartstrings to go through that, i'm sure.

[charitha19]

as a former owner of a TT B4 i find it utterly amazing how u lost control of that car.. i was actually trying my hardest to make the car lose control so that it wasn't a idiot proof car..

i was used to the astina and how u have to be a good driver to handle the car.. but the B4 even my wifey took a corner at around 110 in it.. but then again cant compare her.. she is a bit of a manic even with her swift.. but then again.. how fast were u going mr carbon.. because the VDC should kick in too..

[The Stig]

machang...afaik...air bag sensors don't need to be hit. they measure rapid deceleration and fire up! hence they are called accelerometers.

with the level of damage you describe, air bags should have gone.

Yep the newer ones have an accelerometer which triggers when the G force is a little higher than what a car will experience in say a hard braking situation.

But older cars did have something called a "crush sensor' (not entirely sure of the technical term is), but i doubt the B4 didnt have an accelerometer sensor.

I don't think its the case.... a rapid deceleration does not necessarily trigger the bags to go off, there needs to be impact, and that too a significant one.

You clearly have no idea what you are talking about. A crash is also a rapid deceleration ! The accelerometer measures the G force of the deceleration and takes a mathematical decision to deploy or not.

Say you were going at 120 and suddenly braked and say your car dropped its speed to 85kmph that means the sensor registers it at 1g and , but if you hit a wall after that it will come to stand still in 1 second i.e about 3g and the sensor decides there is no way this cars brakes can generate such a massive g force (takes into account the sudden change of g force) and deploys the air bags.

(For those who dont under stand what a G is; if you change your speed by 35kmph in 1 second you have experienced a 1g)

So you dont necessarily have to hit and crush the air bag sensor in modern cars cause it measure the change of velocity, not if the unit had hit something or not. Judging by the speeds you mentioned i would definitely say your air bag sensor is malfunctioning for sure.

Edited April 10, 2012 by The Stig

[CARBON B4]

Nope. they do work on rapid deceleration. Impacts are infact rapid decelerations and that's how the sensors pick up when to fire the bags.

http://www.midsouthrescue.org/id7.html

If the impact was hard enough to bend a chassis, needing a jig to re align....the airbags should have deployed.

Unless there is something wrong with the system.

I did some reading up on it after the crash and like whats said in your link there are several sensors that feed data for the unit to determine the severity of the crash and if its worth deploying the bags.... Although I was going at about 100, was able to bring down the speed to maybe 40kms ( my guess) at the point of impact, actually the left light was not damaged and only broke from the bracket, I have few pics just after the crash and when u look at it it does not look bad... but quite surprisingly the chassis was affected from that, maybe the angle in which it hit ? Guys at Senok did check the bags and confirmed it was in order, well I guess there is no other way to actually check if the bags inflate or not , unless I crash it again..... ?

@ Charitha19 & Komi : The problem was there was a van ( also traveling at high speed) on the wrong side, so had to do a very sharp right turn to avoid hitting the idiot. I dont blame the car its actually quite stable, but I should have been able to get out of it.. Although I do kick myself for it, its no big deal as no one was hurt, cars can be repaired or even replaced.......and you just try to make most of a bad situation....

Got some pics of if but cannot seem to upload, if anyone is keen drop me a pm and I will mail it....

[CARBON B4]

Judging by the speeds you mentioned i would definitely say your air bag sensor is malfunctioning for sure.

The speed at the point of impact was much less thanks to the brakes ( had the front pads replaced couple of months prior) .

Anyway is there any way to actually check if it works ? I assume the dash light comes on and after it detects and checks if everything is in order the light goes off, there is no issue on that and the boys at Senok too checked it and confirmed. Is there anything else I need to check for or do myself ( other than crash the car) to see if it functions ok ?

[Chooti Putha]

Yep the newer ones have an accelerometer which triggers when the G force is a little higher than what a car will experience in say a hard braking situation.

But older cars did have something called a "crush sensor' (not entirely sure of the technical term is), but i doubt the B4 didnt have an accelerometer sensor.

You clearly have no idea what you are talking about. A crash is also a rapid deceleration ! The accelerometer measures the G force of the deceleration and takes a mathematical decision to deploy or not.

Say you were going at 120 and suddenly braked and say your car dropped its speed to 85kmph that means the sensor registers it at 1g and , but if you hit a wall after that it will come to stand still in 1 second i.e about 3g and the sensor decides there is no way this cars brakes can generate such a massive g force (takes into account the sudden change of g force) and deploys the air bags.

(For those who dont under stand what a G is; if you change your speed by 35kmph in 1 second you have experienced a 1g)

So you dont necessarily have to hit and crush the air bag sensor in modern cars cause it measure the change of velocity, not if the unit had hit something or not. Judging by the speeds you mentioned i would definitely say your air bag sensor is malfunctioning for sure.

In 2010 at the pelwatte rally one of the Honda's had a flat tire half way in to the stage & he kept running. All of a sudden without even having an impact the air bags deployed while on the stretch. So im guessing it would have been from some kind of vibration since the terrain was pretty rough

Edited April 10, 2012 by Chooti Putha

[VVTi]

The speed at the point of impact was much less thanks to the brakes ( had the front pads replaced couple of months prior) .

Anyway is there any way to actually check if it works ? I assume the dash light comes on and after it detects and checks if everything is in order the light goes off, there is no issue on that and the boys at Senok too checked it and confirmed. Is there anything else I need to check for or do myself ( other than crash the car) to see if it functions ok ?

AS much as it is tempting to say something cocky, since its a life saving piece of kit I won't...

What you have to do is first check with the previous owner if by any chance he deactivated/disconnecetd any sensors. (Mind you some people actually disconnect the airbag as a money saving excercise, in case of an accident and for the same lame brain reason you have given regarding how the insurance writes off if the air bags deploy).

Then during the start up sequence, see if the AIR BAG light comes on and switches off after while. If it does, what it indicates is that the self test is OK. If it stays on, then there is an aerror. However this is not a confirmation that the systme is ok. If the OBDII tells you system is working, then as far as you can see the, the system is working.

I have come across some really smart mechanics who put a small timer circuit on the Check Engine light to switch it off after a while when a serious falw is tehre at the time of selling.

My freind ins Seeduwa who ha s garage once showed me a FB15 that had this little gizmo fixed to the back of the cluster, all it does is switch the CE light after a while. He dosconnected it and the CE came on and when scanned showed a whole lot of errors that took the owner some hard cash to remove.

Manually trace and check the sensors to see if any wires are loose or sockets are not connected. It could be something simple.

In the E39, I am getting a constant AB error. When I had it checked, all airbags (6 of them ) are all fine, sensors are fine, the problem was the passenger seat occupancy sensor. It was worn and was not telling the airbag control unit that the system is having a failure. The 164 threw a error once that was casued by a faulty accelerometer inside the car. THat was changed and the error reset itself,

In your case, regardless of the dramatic maneuvers you pulled off to save the car and the van, the airbag shouod have gone off as that in any book is a bad ass frontal crash.

I strongly advise against crashing a car to see if they work as that is what a brainless twat would do.

[The Stig]

The speed at the point of impact was much less thanks to the brakes ( had the front pads replaced couple of months prior) .

Anyway is there any way to actually check if it works ? I assume the dash light comes on and after it detects and checks if everything is in order the light goes off, there is no issue on that and the boys at Senok too checked it and confirmed. Is there anything else I need to check for or do myself ( other than crash the car) to see if it functions ok ?

VVTi pretty much covered the whole testing part i guess.

Could be possible that its not faulty at all and it didnt trigger cause the change of speed from the impact wasn't sudden enough. Maybe the damage to the car was cause of debris fallen onto the car instead of damaging it by the head on collusion ? also if the impact was a bit sideways its possible that the unit disregarded the deployment, they are designed to measure g force in a head on collusion so an accident at an angle; say you slides and hit the wall at 30 degrees might have not registered properly on the unit.

In 2010 at the pelwatte rally one of the Honda's had a flat tire half way in to the stage & he kept running. All of a sudden without even having an impact the air bags deployed while on the stretch. So im guessing it would have been from some kind of vibration since the terrain was pretty rough

quite possible, its not perfect after all.

Some cars came with a mechanical airbag sensor, they work simply like a clock spring. Those things were well known for accidentally deploying.

[rameez]

machang...afaik...air bag sensors don't need to be hit. they measure rapid deceleration and fire up! hence they are called accelerometers.

with the level of damage you describe, air bags should have gone.

not the earlier version of airbag,s they need to be impacted. I think topgear once proved this, but in todays cars it is done as per what you say...so i guess what carboy had in his car was the older technology. even i have heard of airbags at times failing .....

[Watchman]

not the earlier version of airbag,s they need to be impacted. I think topgear once proved this, but in todays cars it is done as per what you say...so i guess what carboy had in his car was the older technology. even i have heard of airbags at times failing .....

but that isnt exactly an 'old' car...based on the reg number alone I would say it's YOM should be 2000+

[CARBON B4]

Could be possible that its not faulty at all and it didnt trigger cause the change of speed from the impact wasn't sudden enough. Maybe the damage to the car was cause of debris fallen onto the car instead of damaging it by the head on collusion ? also if the impact was a bit sideways its possible that the unit disregarded the deployment, they are designed to measure g force in a head on collusion so an accident at an angle; say you slides and hit the wall at 30 degrees might have not registered properly on the unit.

Thats the same conclusion I came to as well since everything else checked out ok.. also I did not crash in to something solid, it went in to a " Pas Kandiya " , so it may have soften the impact. I was wearing the seatbelt, but even if it was not worn there would not have been any issue, the car absorbs the impact very well, I guess thanks to the crumple zones.

but that isnt exactly an 'old' car...based on the reg number alone I would say it's YOM should be 2000+

YOM is 1999, and if I remember correctly it has the " crush" type sensor not the accelerometer, which was missed by an inch or less.....

[VVTi]

YOM is 1999, and if I remember correctly it has the " crush" type sensor not the accelerometer, which was missed by an inch or less.....

Cha... so old skool...