Ee110 Burning Oil

[KFL]

One of my friends has recently bought a Corolla EE110 (1.3L, 1997). Till about one month from purchase, he had no issues with the vehicle. But he has now found out that the car is actually burning oil. There is no visible leak and the engine heat is at the average level too. There is a little bit of white smoke coming out when starting/racing but it does not exhaust any smoke once you get going. According to him, it has 1.70k km on it, which he now believes is doctored. He's not a very rich guy, so he must get going with this car anyway. Which options has he got? What could be done to fix the issue at a minimal cost (rather than the obvious oil top up). Would appreciate your expert advise

P.S: He says that it is slow to start up if kept idle for about a day. He's not a heavy runner, probably about 100km per week.

[hasmax]

um not an expert at all.. await the best from them.. what i feel is that for a petrol vehicle burning oil means dt vehicle is a piece of crap. It is 110 so relatively not so old car. previous owner must be a real asshole to make a petrol 110 a burning oil one.. considering future possible repairs i feel like putting a new engine is a good option as they are not so expensive compared to diesel ones.. my friend told me that there are petrol engines around 15000 even.. check it out.. and pls wait since our senior experts give their opinion as that will be the best.. sad for the friend

[KFL]

um not an expert at all.. await the best from them.. what i feel is that for a petrol vehicle burning oil means dt vehicle is a piece of crap. It is 110 so relatively not so old car. previous owner must be a real asshole to make a petrol 110 a burning oil one.. considering future possible repairs i feel like putting a new engine is a good option as they are not so expensive compared to diesel ones.. my friend told me that there are petrol engines around 15000 even.. check it out.. and pls wait since our senior experts give their opinion as that will be the best.. sad for the friend

Thanks! I too suggested of replacing the engine, but he wants to wait and see to find out what is the best long term solution (and since he only recently bought it, I guess probably the dude is kinda cash strapped right now too).

[The Stig]

One of my friends has recently bought a Corolla EE110 (1.3L, 1997). Till about one month from purchase, he had no issues with the vehicle. But he has now found out that the car is actually burning oil. There is no visible leak and the engine heat is at the average level too. There is a little bit of white smoke coming out when starting/racing but it does not exhaust any smoke once you get going. According to him, it has 1.70k km on it, which he now believes is doctored. He's not a very rich guy, so he must get going with this car anyway. Which options has he got? What could be done to fix the issue at a minimal cost (rather than the obvious oil top up). Would appreciate your expert advise

P.S: He says that it is slow to start up if kept idle for about a day. He's not a heavy runner, probably about 100km per week.

How does your friend know it burns oil ? Did he notice a drop in oil level ?

If there is a drop in oil level and if the exhaust smoke is a bit white in color the car most probably has worn out internal parts like piston rings etc.

Just to make sure remove the spark plugs and see the color of the spark plugs, if its black and oily definitely oil is entering the cylinders ( take a look at this for color reference http://www.dansmc.com/Spark_Plugs/Spark_Plugs_catalog.html )

What he could do is an engine rebuild but given the fact that a new engine would now only cost about 30k i would suggest him to replace the engine itself as the engine is old and is probably susceptible to failures of other parts in the future. He could run with the same setup without any repairs for a short period but it would lead to other issues like power loss,low fuel economy and even failing at the emissions tests, 30k might sound like a lot but if he plans to use this vehicle for 2-3 years its a worthy investment.

Also on side note its highly unlikely that this problem emerged over night, it probably was there even at the time of purchase and wasn't noticed by your friend.

what i feel is that for a petrol vehicle burning oil means dt vehicle is a piece of crap. It is 110 so relatively not so old car. previous owner must be a real asshole to make a petrol 110 a burning oil one..

Disagree, though it might be true that the previous owner might have been negligent in terms of maintenance worn out internal are something very common. Simple if you have parts that move they will wear out overtime, but yes not doing regular oil changes might have accelerated the process.

Edited November 10, 2011 by The Stig

[KFL]

Stig, thank you very much. Yes, he had noticed a drop in oil levels. I have no idea about the plugs though. But given that it apparently has an ignition issue too, how to know whether the issue plug condition was caused by oil pumping or not? How long might he be able to run on the same setup? And where to source a good engine, if you can give some hints?

Obviously it did not emerge overnight. But I too am surprised since when I saw the car a couple of days after his purchase, it performed smoothly and had no hint of smoke at all. I wonder what was the mechanism used by the previous owner to hide this?

[carboy2011]

This is a common thing sellers use and camoflage worn out engines and sell it off,5/10 times they succeed in selling it off,I hear they use a higher grade of engine oil or additives to make it smoke less (correct me if im wrong)

[The Don]

White smoke could indicate oil burning but it could also indicate coolant or something else getting into the combustion chamber (head gasket failure).

Because of the relative age of the car, I think if its burning oil its probably the valve seats which have worn out. If its the piston rings you might get away with replacing the ring set and getting another 50K KMs or so from the engine before you need to do a full rebuild.

Replacing the engine should only be considered if you can source the engine for about 30K because over that just repairing is a better option if its one of the issues I mentioned above. Best take to a competent mechanic at the earliest instance.

[Ripper]

White smoke could indicate oil burning but it could also indicate coolant or something else getting into the combustion chamber (head gasket failure).

Because of the relative age of the car, I think if its burning oil its probably the valve seats which have worn out. If its the piston rings you might get away with replacing the ring set and getting another 50K KMs or so from the engine before you need to do a full rebuild.

Replacing the engine should only be considered if you can source the engine for about 30K because over that just repairing is a better option if its one of the issues I mentioned above. Best take to a competent mechanic at the earliest instance.

1+

startup white smoke.....not present while running... usually sounds like a valve seal issue. Not a biggie to sort out cos it's only a top end job.

Does the car smoke significantly more of you start it after resting it for a few days?

Does the smoke disappear completely after the engine runs for a while?

If this is the case...get the top end valve seal attended to first and see how it goes... even for a ring set replacement...the engine has to come out.

Significantly more complex job than just sorting out the valve seals...

[KFL]

1+

startup white smoke.....not present while running... usually sounds like a valve seal issue. Not a biggie to sort out cos it's only a top end job.

Does the car smoke significantly more of you start it after resting it for a few days?

Does the smoke disappear completely after the engine runs for a while?

If this is the case...get the top end valve seal attended to first and see how it goes... even for a ring set replacement...the engine has to come out.

Significantly more complex job than just sorting out the valve seals...

I have now seen it and it smokes if you pedal heavily following getting going (it's 1.3, so you need to pedal a bit), but no smoke at all once you get going. The smoke comes out only during the start up phase. No idea whether the smoke is higher if it is idle for a few days. Oil burn however is almost confirmed.

[raveeJaya]

Hi Experts,

Me too have an AE110 and the meter says 140000km.Me too experience the same engine oil burning issue.When I analyze the issue it seems when the engine run more than 3000 km after the oil change, the oil burning gets higher.My Car is doing about 11-12km/l in out station and arround 8 km/l in Colombo with A/C. Also pulling power is less some times. (This is not always).

When I did the Emission test last june,they said engine out put is almost like brand new.(Note: I did the engine tune up just 2 weeks before the emission test).So if the engine is having an under compression issue can the emission test result be good as brand new. ?

Will the issue can be fixed only replacing the Ring set?

1. Any idea about the cost of replacing ring set and any known person to do the job ?

2. Cost of doing the full engine over haul ?

Thanks

[Sylvi]

Member,

Do you want a Mechanic to come home and do the engine repair or give same to a garage to repair.

Sylvi Wijesinghe.

[raveeJaya]

Hi Sylvi,

It would be great if the mechanic can come to my home and do the repair.

Thanks,

Ravi

[Sylvi]

Mr. Ravi,

Please contact Shelton 5024072. He will come with his son who is a mechanic also. First of all get a quotation before any thing. Agree to a amount and give him the work. I know him for last 40 years never done any thing wrong to me.

Best regards,

Sylvi Wijesinghe.

Email: <[email protected]><[email protected]

[raveeJaya]

Dear Mr Sylvi,

Thanks a lot for your help.

Ravi..

[The Don]

Hi Experts,

Me too have an AE110 and the meter says 140000km.Me too experience the same engine oil burning issue.When I analyze the issue it seems when the engine run more than 3000 km after the oil change, the oil burning gets higher.My Car is doing about 11-12km/l in out station and arround 8 km/l in Colombo with A/C. Also pulling power is less some times. (This is not always).

When I did the Emission test last june,they said engine out put is almost like brand new.(Note: I did the engine tune up just 2 weeks before the emission test).So if the engine is having an under compression issue can the emission test result be good as brand new. ?

Will the issue can be fixed only replacing the Ring set?

1. Any idea about the cost of replacing ring set and any known person to do the job ?

2. Cost of doing the full engine over haul ?

Thanks

I don't think your car is burning oil, its probably an oil leak somewhere. The reason I say this is if it did burn oil it will definitely get picked up in the emissions test. There is a slight possibility that your valve seals are faulty and in this case at early stages it will only burn oil when revved hard!

[raveeJaya]

Hi Done,

You are absolutely correct!!. I checked the vehicle and there was a slight oil leak from the Oil removing nut. So that issue was sorted out.

I thought following issue is due to the engine under compression. But now I realize, since there is no oil burning following issue some thing different.

There is another issue I have with the Distributor. I showed this to few mechanics who do engine tuneups. Even after the engine tune up the engine gives a noise (taka taka) when accelerating (The sound you here when the distributor not adjusted properly ).

One guy told me this can not be stopped since the distributor have some issue.

I did a tune up in June and used NGK spark plugs.

One guy told me to replace the spark plug with Denso (K16R-U11) spark plug. If i use Denso spark plugs can this issue be resolved?

Guys please help me to resolve this issue.

Thanks,

Ravi.

[Sylvi]

Hi Done,

You are absolutely correct!!. I checked the vehicle and there was a slight oil leak from the Oil removing nut. So that issue was sorted out.

I thought following issue is due to the engine under compression. But now I realize, since there is no oil burning following issue some thing different.

There is another issue I have with the Distributor. I showed this to few mechanics who do engine tuneups. Even after the engine tune up the engine gives a noise (taka taka) (The sound you here when the distributor not adjusted properly ).

One guy told me this can not be stopped since the distributor have some issue.

I did a tune up in June and used NGK spark plugs.

One guy told me to replace the spark plug with Denso (K16R-U11) spark plug. If i use Denso spark plugs can this issue be resolved?

Guys please help me to resolve this issue.

Thanks,

Ravi.

Ravi,

Changing to another make of spark plugs will not solve your (TAKA TAKE ) noise, this may be some thing to do on your engine tappets or bearing knock, sometimes it will be as mechanics had said on the distributor. get a experienced mechanic to check and do the need full.

Do this sound get more when you do high acceleration on your engine. Or it is only at acceleration, normal idling do you hear very low sound.

Sylvi Wijesinghe.

[raveeJaya]

Hi Sylvi,

Actually the noise is coming even if the AC is off and if you are in L gear and when you accelerate .

Also when you accelerate little bit in any gear the Taka taka noise is coming. Some times I can get rid of that noise by releasing the accelerator and again paddle it harder.

FYI : Once we have get rid of the noise by retarding the Delco.But at that time pulling power was very less and then we had to advanced it again.

When the engine is idling there is no special sound coming out.

There is another special thing to mention about the ECU of the Car and this issue may related to this. About 1 year back I had a issue with check engine bulb.The issue was in the ECU.Electrical guy had replace one Capacitor and few burned resistors to overcome the issue.

Then the issue was solved.

Appreciate valuable comments ,

[The Don]

Hi Done,

You are absolutely correct!!. I checked the vehicle and there was a slight oil leak from the Oil removing nut. So that issue was sorted out.

I thought following issue is due to the engine under compression. But now I realize, since there is no oil burning following issue some thing different.

There is another issue I have with the Distributor. I showed this to few mechanics who do engine tuneups. Even after the engine tune up the engine gives a noise (taka taka) when accelerating (The sound you here when the distributor not adjusted properly ).

One guy told me this can not be stopped since the distributor have some issue.

I did a tune up in June and used NGK spark plugs.

One guy told me to replace the spark plug with Denso (K16R-U11) spark plug. If i use Denso spark plugs can this issue be resolved?

Guys please help me to resolve this issue.

Thanks,

Ravi.

Hi Ravi,

I had a few problems in my car as well, and I'll share my experiences and perhaps it will give you a few ideas. My car is a Mitsubishi so the systems are a little different but the basic principles are probably the same.

Now this taka taka noise you can't really say what it is until you hear it because there is two common taka taka noises. And you really have to make sure the noise you hear is from the engine because you get similar noises from suspension and also the axles namely from the CV joints and the gear box ends of the axle rods. I once had a taka taka noise coming from a metal plate in the braking system. So its important to isolate the problem.

On the engine one common taka taka noise is known as tappet noise when tappets are not adjusted properly but modern cars have self adjusting tappets so if this is the case the issue will be down to worn tappets or an oil pressure issue on the tappet oil line (if you have hydraulic tappets).

The second such issue is the taka taka noise that which the engine generates to let you know that you are in the wrong gear and to down shift. When this happens all the time it's usually an indicator that your engine is not producing as much power as it did before. This could be down to issues with the ignition, fuel injection or engine timing, or at extreme cases the ECU which holds it all together.

Again the first thing to do is to isolate the problem and if it is engine related and not the tappets, given the issue you had with your ECU, I will get an engine analysis reports and if it gives any strange readings the ECU might be a suspect (I had that issue in my car and found that the ECU had been repaired before. I replaced the ECU to resolve the problem). If the report looks or or pin points an error with another system you can proceed to investigate the other issues.

If you haven't done this in a while I also propose the following.

1. Find the correct NGK part number for the spark plug to your engine (don't believe people in the shops, they sell you whatever they have and twice I wasted money buying sets of the wrong spark plugs) and replace the set. While you are doing that check the quality of the HT leads and replace as necessary.

2. Get your throttle body, MAF sensor, airlines cleaned. Ensure that the air filter is in good order.

3. Clean the injectors, fuel line and check and replace the fuel filter if necessary.

The above should be part of routine annual maintenance particularly in SL where low quality fuel and harsh climate tends to cause a lot of problems to car engines. I did the above in my car in April and felt a marked difference in performance.

[raveeJaya]

Hi Don,

Thank you for sharing me your knowledge and experience.

actually im sure that the issue is from the Engine and its not something with tappet noise.

The noise is the one as you said "noise that which the engine generates to let you know that you are in the wrong gear and to down shift."

Actually for AE110 (5A-FE engine)Toyota recommended Denso (K16R-U11) spark plug.So I'm going to try it out.

Also I haven't replace the fuel filter for years.So i need to replace that with a new filter.

I have done other stuffs related to the engine tune up in June and hope they are not necessary at this moment.

Thanks again for the valuable reply.

[Sylvi]

Hi Sylvi,

Actually the noise is coming even if the AC is off and if you are in L gear and when you accelerate .

Also when you accelerate little bit in any gear the Taka taka noise is coming. Some times I can get rid of that noise by releasing the accelerator and again paddle it harder.

FYI : Once we have get rid of the noise by retarding the Delco.But at that time pulling power was very less and then we had to advanced it again.

When the engine is idling there is no special sound coming out.

There is another special thing to mention about the ECU of the Car and this issue may related to this. About 1 year back I had a issue with check engine bulb.The issue was in the ECU.Electrical guy had replace one Capacitor and few burned resistors to overcome the issue.

Then the issue was solved.

Appreciate valuable comments ,

'raveeJaya',

As for your post I understand you do not get the noise, when you retard the engine, then the pulling power becomes less and engine will run with out the noise.According to my knowledge, This is the Ignition knock what you hear. the spark plugs fire at incorrect time.

Best thing to go to a good tuner first explain what you have done all repairairs to ECU. Person like Mr. Mario who is having a work shop near Milk Board factory opposite side passing the railway line almost close to Lanlib ofiice and outlet.

Some times the Eletronic tecnition who did the repair, of your ECU did he have the testing equipment after repairing the ECU to find out the ECU is functioning to original settings,are you sure did he changed same parts or equlent to the parts of what was on the ECU board.

Other alternative is to try out with a good working condition ECU so that you will know your ECU is working correctly.

Sylvi Wijesinghe.

[raveeJaya]

Hi Sylvi,

Thank you for your valuable advice.

Yes, as you said the noise is ignition knocking sound.

Today early morning I travel about 5 km to dop my wife and there was steep hill on my way.But I didn't here that knocking sound and car was having the normal pulling power. So it seems engine was not knocking today morning.

Please let me know the location of the Mr Mario place. Are you referring Mr mario place is near the Lanlib PVt Ltd at Navam mawatha ?

Thanks again,

Ravi

[Sylvi]

Hi Sylvi,

Thank you for your valuable advice.

Yes, as you said the noise is ignition knocking sound.

Today early morning I travel about 5 km to dop my wife and there was steep hill on my way.But I didn't here that knocking sound and car was having the normal pulling power. So it seems engine was not knocking today morning.

Please let me know the location of the Mr Mario place. Are you referring Mr mario place is near the Lanlib PVt Ltd at Navam mawatha ?

Thanks again,

Ravi

Mr. Ravi,

This work shop is situated on the road to Nawala from Thimbirigasyaya junction, Police Hospital then the railway line few shops after that.Next to Coconut development Board. Name of the Garage is MOTOR TECHINIKA Tel:2581342 HP: 0777380771. owners Name is Mr. Mario Dias.

Sylvi Wijesinghe.

Edited November 19, 2011 by Sylvi

[raveeJaya]

Mr. Sylvi,

Thanks for the contact details. I will visit him and let you know the out comes.

Ravi.

[raveeJaya]

Mr Sylvi,

Thank you for your help on the this. I went to meet Mr Mario and he keep my Car at his place for 3 days.

He start to investigate the issue by doing the Tune up and changing the Spark plug.Which I was sure the issue is not with them since I have already try them before. After that he said this issue can be due to carbon build up on the Head area of the engine.So he had a chemical to clean the head area of the engine.Once he did the clean , the problem goes away !!!.

Thanks all for helping me to solve the issue.

Edited January 3, 2012 by raveeJaya